Subject: Re: Features V stability, Paragraph numbering
From: Virgil Arrington Jr. (firstname.lastname@example.org)
Date: Fri May 04 2001 - 12:32:53 CDT
I have encountered the same problems, but have a different solution. I
agree that normally, using styles to provide spacing between paragraphs
(including numbered paragraphs) is the better way to go -- Except in the
situation where you are also numbering your lines in the left margin as in a
legal document. In such a case, the extra space between paragraphs doesn't
get a line number on the left and the resulting document looks awful.
The solution, rather than adding additional space between paragraphs is to
hit <shift-enter> rather than <enter> when you want to create an empty line
between numbered paragraphs. The <shift-enter> creates a line break instead
of a paragraph break. The new blank line doesn't get a number for a new
paragraph, but it does get a number in the left margin for line numbering.
Then, after creating the new line, hit <enter> to create the next paragraph,
complete with the continued paragraph numbering scheme.
I also agree that most programs do not have intuitive styles
implementations. Actually, the best I ever saw was years ago in AmiPro 3.1.
>From: Ron Ross <email@example.com>
>Subject: Re: Features V stability
>Date: 03 May 2001 22:37:28 -0400
>A corrective followup to my previous post:
>Ron Ross <firstname.lastname@example.org> writes:
> > Neil Timms <email@example.com> writes:
> > > I used 0.7.13 for a 20+ pages legal style document and found that is
> > > easer to use than other wp for numbered paras (well done those who
> > > that bit) - the problem came when saving to rtf so that I could
> > > data with others still using Word - no numbers on the para (I think
> > > for 0.7.14?). The issue in the end was was not so much in the use of
> > > program but in the format of the data.
> > I haven't checked this in AbiWord for myself, but I know from having
> > created rtf and Word documents in either WordPerfect or through
> > SGML->DSSSL (with Openjade) that autogenerated numbers/letters in things
> > like outlines, lists, page numbers, and so on, will often _first_ appear
> > broken in Word (usually all entries are "1" or "A" or whatever the
> > scheme is based on), but if you then scroll through the document in
> > "Normal" view and call for a "refresh" of the document (I'm sorry, this
> > last function is a little obscure to me now, and I'm not on Windows at
> > the moment and can't check, but it's something accessed through the menu
> > and has to do with Page layout, or specifically with page numbers), then
> > all the numbers get properly incremented.
>OK. Back in Windows, and I took the time to check this, and indeed, as
>Neil's following post indicates, numbered paragraphs are read properly
>in Word when saved in rtf. However, I've found a condition in which the
>above anomily is manifest. If, in AW, you follow a numbered paragraph
>with two newlines, thus ending the list, and then continue the list in
>the following paragraph, that continuation is not interpreted correctly
>in Word, producing the effect described above. Moral: if you want that
>extra space between items, then apply paragraph styling to produce it
>rather than entering another newline. I haven't experimented more
>thoroughly with situations in which you would really want to continue a
>I hope this is useful to others. It was a revelation to me, for
>off-topic reasons, because I was in the habit of using a feature of
>WordPerfect that should perhaps be considered a bug (or bad hack) and
>that I had even been considering for an AW bug report/feature request!
>On terminating a numbered paragraph, in all mentioned word processors,
>another such paragraph with an incremented number is automatically
>created. In AW and Word, if you hit return again, the listing is ended
>and you're back to "normal" (or whatever). In WP, a second return adds a
>newline previous to the new autogenerated numbered paragraph, pushing
>the latter and the cursor position down one line, and you can add as
>many such intermediate newlines as desired while preserving your
>position in the ordered paragraphs. This makes it easy, as a Normal
>User, to produce the desired spacing layout for listed items, in the
>same sense that the normal user usually hits return twice between
>paragraphs instead of defining inter-paragraph spacing in their default
>paragraph style. Moral: don't do that. But this also calls for a robust,
>logical, consistent and intuitive styles implementation and interface,
>which no word processor now provides. More on that later.
>Cheers to all,
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